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 The Football Diner Big Interview:
David Fleming
interviewed by Sam Monson
9/2/2008
Following on from the Diner’s piece on the Pottsville Maroons, we’ve been in touch with ESPN writer, and author of Breaker Boys for his take on the Maroons, and the story of the stolen Championship of 1925.
David Fleming first stumbled upon the Pottsville Maroons during the course of his day job as an ESPN writer when he was looking through the schedule for the NFL Owners Meeting some years ago. He did a bit of digging, and came across one of the biggest injustices in sporting history. In his book he delivers the truth, and the background to one of the greatest teams ever to step onto an NFL playing field, shunned by the NFL after delivering it unmatched credibility.
David Fleming’s book has been a tremendous success, and he hopes it will only help to highlight the injustice suffered by the Maroons, and the people of Pottsville. Fleming remains dedicated to the Maroons’ cause, and has been spending time since the release of the book trying to collect even greater support.
We asked him to stop by the Diner to tell us the full story:
FD
Thanks for taking the time to talk to the Diner David.
David
My pleasure. Thanks for all the great support of the Maroons and Breaker Boys. One of the great things about this cause is the way it shows just how much power the average fan still has. I mean, this is a team that hasn’t played a game in eight decades, yet, thanks to great fans and websites like the Diner, the Maroons cause is growing stronger by the day.
FD
What first set you on the trail of the Pottsville Maroons?
David
It’s amazing, really, but I stumbled upon this storyone of the greatest untold stories in the history of the league. In 2003 I was reading the agenda for the NFL owners meeting and saw the item that said the town of Pottsville would petition the NFL to have their 1925 championship returned to the rightful owners. I did a little bit of research and the hair on the back of my neck stood up. I knew I had stumbled across the story of a lifetime.
FD
When did you decide to write a book on the subject? Was there anything that started that?
David
From a writer’s perspective you could not ask for a better story: such great, colourful characters, an amazing town, the era of the Roaring Twenties. The coach was an ornithologist, the tailback was a dentist, the fullback was a politician, the best lineman wore a baseball hat instead of a helmet and the punter met his wife when one of his kicks sailed into the stands and knocked her out. But it wasn’t until I discovered the way the league and the historians were treating the team and the fans that I got involved with the book. The NFL has been condescending and dismissive of a team and a town that, really, helped make it what it is today. The Maroons deserve much better. And it was clear that the NFL and its so-called historians never thought they’d have to answer to anyone for their nasty treatment of this team. I hope the book has given this team and this town a voice.
FD
How hectic has your life been since the book came out, it seems to have really galvanised support for the Maroons again.
David
The book has been outselling Harry Potter in eastern Pennsylvaniathat’s a sentence not too many authors get to write. It has been crazy but, at the same time, it has also been every writer’s dream. I knew football fans in this region would support the book but I had no idea the depth of the emotion and commitment to this team. I mean, I signed 700 books at my last book tour event and many people, after waiting in line for more than two hours, just broke down crying when they finally got a chance to say, in person, how much the team meant to them. The one thing football and futbol have in common is the way both sports transcend the playing field and act as a unifying force for people who would otherwise not have anything in common.
FD
Leaving aside the 1925 Championship for a moment, do you think any Maroons players deserve some more recognition for the Hall of Fame guys like Tony Latone maybe?
David
I’ve always said the second greatest injusticebehind the stolen 1925 championship–is the fact that running back Tony Latone is not in the Hall of Fame. Red Grange is considered a pillar of pro football. Yet in 30 fewer games, Latone ran for more yards and scored more touchdowns than Grange. No one was a bigger fan of Latone than Grange. He talked about him whenever he could. Yet Latone remains largely unknown to most football fans.
FD
What was it like talking to guys that were actually around to see the things most of us only know about from history?
David
It was like stepping into a time machine and going back to one of the most amazing, revolutionary times in the history of the United States. Like most people I had always thought of the Roaring Twenties as one big party when, in fact, it was a very divisive time in our country’s history. The country was divided on almost all levels: urban versus rural, religion, social classes, Victorian old guard versus the new, progressive consumer-driven middle class. What makes the Maroons so special is the trail they blazed as one of the first pro football teams to bring all the different sections of society together at the stadiumeven if it was only for a few hours each Sunday.
FD
Why do you think the NFL’s been so reluctant to ever redress the balance towards the Maroons?
David
They’re lazy and uninformed. I think if the owners, the so-called guardians of the game, would take their jobs seriously and learn the story of the Maroonsone of the teams that helped created the league they all benefit from greatlythey’d vote next week to do the right thing. It’s not the easiest thing in the world to get 32 billionaires to study up on a team that’s 83 years old, but we’re doing it. The Maroons need an owner to step forward and become their advocate and if one doesn’t in the near future, fans should put pressure on them and demand it.
FD
Looking at the big picture, just how good were the 1925 Pottsville Maroons?
David
I always say they were the most dominant, influential team in the NFL history. They could physically beat up the league’s toughest team’s, they could outsmart the best-coached teams and they could outrun, out pass and out think any opponent. Frankford was a great franchise (they won the NFL title in 1926), the Maroons beat them 49-0. Green Bay was great. The Maroons beat them 31-0. Canton was the NFL’s first dynasty and the Maroons crushed them 28-0. Notre Dame was considered the greatest football team ever assembled and the Maroons beat them 9-7 at a time when the NFL was thought to be decades behind the college game. The Maroons beating Notre Dame’s Four Horsemen was like the crew at Footballdiner.com forming a team and beating Manchester United.
FD
Well David, the book’s been a tremendous success, and we here at the Diner enjoyed it hugely. Congratulations on the book, and for taking the time to talk to us. Where can fans over here find out more about the Maroons and help them get their Championship back?
David
Again, it’s my pleasure and I should be thanking you for the support and for spreading the word. The Maroons, and the lack of respect and recognition for this team, has become a metaphor for this entire region and I can’t tell you what it means to these fans to have your support. To learn more people can, of course, get the book, Breaker Boys at Amazon.com and then lend it out to all their friends; they can go to www.breakerboys1925.com and jump on the message boards there to show support; they can sign the petition on behalf of the team at www.petitiononline.com/Maroons and, again, I encourage everyone reading this to blog, to email and to jump on message boards all over the world to spread the word.
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